David Gregory: Small Diameter Pipe Rehabilitation

00:00:00 Speaker 1
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00:00:27 Speaker 2
Welcome to The Energy Pipeline Podcast with your host, KC Yost. Tune in each week to learn more about industry issues, tools, and resources to streamline and modernize the future of the industry. Whether you work in oil and gas or bring a unique perspective, this podcast is your knowledge transfer hub. Welcome to The Energy Pipeline.

00:00:51 KC Yost
Hello everyone, and welcome to this episode of The Energy Pipeline Podcast. Today, our topic is small diameter pipe rehabilitation using reinforced thermoplastic pipe. We're fortunate to have David Gregory, business development manager for FlexSteel Pipeline Technologies, as our guest. Welcome to The Energy Pipeline Podcast, David. We're thrilled you took the time to visit with us today.

00:01:16 David Gregory
Absolutely. Thanks, KC.

00:01:19 KC Yost
Glad to have you here. So David, I know you're a proud graduate of Texas A&M, truly an Aggie.

00:01:25 David Gregory
Yes, sir.

00:01:25 KC Yost
If you take a few minutes and share a bit of your background with our listeners.

00:01:29 David Gregory
Yeah, absolutely. Definitely a proud graduate of Texas A&M. Graduated in 2014 with a petroleum engineering degree, at which point the energy industry was booming. So I was fortunate enough to get a job with an operator in the upstream oil and gas space. A few years after that, found an opportunity with FlexSteel Pipeline, was able to leverage my knowledge and my background of the upstream space on the OEM side there. And really enjoy the business development, the project aspect side of the industry. So found a great opportunity and it's blossomed into what is now today the manager of business development of FlexSteel. So it's been a fun ride such as the oil and gas industry, I suppose.

00:02:17 KC Yost
Yes, absolutely. And you're traveling quite a bit. Didn't you just get back from Denver?

00:02:22 David Gregory
Yes, sir. It seems like the airport is my second home these days, but that's good, right? I mean, it's a sign of how successful FlexSteel has been in the market. It's really a sign of the market in general for reinforced thermoplastic pipes, which I know we're here to discuss today, so I'm very, very excited for that opportunity.

00:02:39 KC Yost
Outstanding. Outstanding. So before we get specifically into reinforced thermoplastic pipe, let's talk about rehabilitation, if you will, for small diameter long pipeline segments. There are typically four methods that are used in pipeline rehabilitation, isn't there? Aren't there?

00:02:59 David Gregory
Yes, sir. There's four main products or main purposes for pipeline rehabilitation. And in a broader sense, rehabilitation as we see it encompasses the use of existing infrastructure for the installation of a new pipeline. Whether it be for continuation of a service or a complete transition from one service to the next. One of the major focuses from a rehab perspective, you've got a few different options. The cured-in-place, the CIPP products are generally meant to form to the idea of that existing infrastructure. The same goes for your tight-lined thermoplastic, your tight-lined HDPE systems. And so the benefits there of course are you able to maintain the general ID of the infrastructure that you're using. The downsides there, of course, are that you are still relying on the integrity of that host pipe to provide the main pressure-bearing layer on the pipeline system. So certainly, some pros and some cons from that perspective. The third option that comes into play a little less often, but certainly is worth discussing is what we call pipe bursting. Wherein you can actually replace existing infrastructure in kind with the same size or even take a size up in diameter simply by splitting that existing infrastructure in half as you pull through a new product. But really and truly sliplining, as we call it, or pipe-in-pipe rehab as we focus on is again, utilizing that existing infrastructure. And simply pulling our product back through that existing hole in the ground at that point. The benefits there, of course, are that you have a brand-new pipeline, which no longer relies on the integrity of that host pipe. It's simply using that existing infrastructure as a conduit to be pulled through. And then of course, you would have to take a nominal step down in that sense. So there's some pros and cons to it in that regard, but there are a lot of different options out there. And it's certainly a solution that has gained a lot of traction internationally, not as much in the States. But thanks to grassroots efforts and some very successful projects, we're seeing the activity in that regard pick up greatly on our side.

00:05:11 KC Yost
Outstanding. Outstanding. If you don't mind me, just a couple of personal notes. I had our internal water lines here at our house. It's 40 years old. Used the cured-in-place process with an epoxy in lieu of having PEX pipe put into our house. I'm always keen for new technology and all that, so I actually had epoxy blown in and it's worked out extremely well over the last few years. But of course, we're talking about a very low pressure for the water lines here in the house. And I do remember when pipe bursting was a big, big thing years ago, I believe there were some old cast iron lines in one of the boroughs of New York, as I recall. Where they were going through and bursting some of those lines in order to put the new lower pressure lines in. And again, as you mentioned, those first three applications are more for a lower pressure application than they are a higher pressure, correct?

00:06:20 David Gregory
Correct. Yes, sir. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. It's funny you mentioned the home infrastructure there. That's really where this industry kicked off. We've given a few presentations now and give a little bit of background. And it always starts with that in-home replacement of existing infrastructure. And it's very fitting because when we share the concept of rehab with customers, we often use that home setting as an analogy. Everybody has a home, and they can appreciate the challenges of having to fix something. When something does go wrong in your home, you don't up and buy a brand-new house. If the piping in the walls needs to be replaced, you simply fix what you have. And in a pipeline sense, that's what the value of rehabilitation really comes into play is rather than building a brand-new system that has challenges with permitting and routing and price. And now the environmental impact, you can really start to see the advantages from utilizing that existing infrastructure and repurposing it.

00:07:19 KC Yost
Right. And I'm not trying to make a sales pitch here. But my house is 40 years old and we had that CIPP put in six years ago, and it's worked like a charm. So we're living the dream at our house with that. But anyway, get back to sliplining and pipe-in-pipe. Let's start getting into what is RTP, reinforced thermoplastic pipe? What is that? What are we talking about?

00:07:49 David Gregory
Yeah, that's a great question, KC. And so RTP or reinforced thermoplastic pipe generally describes the pipeline industry that utilizes existing materials, often in a repackaged sense to maximize the benefits. So it's generally a three-layer design. You have a thermoplastic liner, which in our case is a 4710 HDPE, the same gas grade material that is widely used in the industry for poly pipe. Which of course brings the inherent benefits of corrosion resistance and flow assurance. After you've laid that thermoplastic liner, you would come back over the top of it with a reinforcing material, hence the name reinforced thermoplastic. And there's a lot of different reinforcing materials on the market, some of which are fiber based, some of which of course are steel based as is with the case with FlexSteel Pipe. But that reinforcement layer is really what defines the capability of the product, the pressure rating, the tensile rating of course, which is critical for pipeline rehabilitation. And really results in some unique value propositions down the road, but ultimately different reinforcement materials that support that HDPE liner. And then you'll come back over the top of that reinforcement with another layer of some thermoplastic material generally there to protect that reinforcement, having no bearing on the pressure rating of the product. But in a similar sense to your corrosion and your FBE and your ARO coatings in the steel world, you've got that outer layer of a thermoplastic material there to protect that reinforcement from a potentially corrosive external environment. So very simple design, but very highly engineered products that were not very commonplace too long ago. In the last few decades, we've really gained a lot of traction and are starting to really challenge the incumbent commoditized materials. The steels and the polys of the pipeline world.

00:09:45 KC Yost
Sure, sure. Is there an SDR range that you normally go with your internal and external, or is that dependent on pressures?

00:09:56 David Gregory
Yeah, so the dimension ratio as is common-

00:09:59 KC Yost
I'm sorry, let's back up for a second. Maybe you need to clarify what SDR is. I'm sorry, I didn't mean to slide that in too quick.

00:10:06 David Gregory
No, no, that's fine. Yeah, so the specified dimension ratio, which is common for monolithic polyethylene products generally does not apply to the RTP space. And the reason for that is when you have a monolithic material, you've got a single wall of material, single body structure that is meant to both contain the fluid and contain the pressures and stresses that are coming with the pipeline operating environment. With the RTP space, and specifically with FlexSteel, you have separated the fluid containment, which is of course the liner from the pressure containment, which is that steel reinforcement. And so you're able to maximize the benefits of each without having to worry about degradation of the performance of either material. Subsequently, we don't have D rates like you would normally with poly, with temperature and hydrocarbon exposure. And we're able to really vastly push the boundaries of what standard poly pipe can handle. So dimension ratios aren't terribly applicable to our product design, but certainly a factor worth considering when you think of the thickness and the durability of the materials that go into the design of our pipeline system.

00:11:18 KC Yost
Well, you can see my ignorance in this field. So I'm glad that you're on the line. I've done a lot of HDPE and this, that, and the other type work. But this RTP sounds really, really fascinating, so thank you for that. We talked a little bit about pipe-in-pipe. You mentioned that a little bit earlier when we were talking about sliplining. Can you describe pipe-in-pipe for me please?

00:11:45 David Gregory
Yeah, again, it's really just the utilization of existing infrastructure for the benefit of oil and gas development. Many of the pipelines that we see our operators operating are, like you'd mentioned, quite old. I mean, many of the projects we look at are 1950s era pipeline. They've done a tremendous job with proper corrosion mitigation and integrity management plans. But at a certain point, they're either no longer fit for service from a wall loss perspective or in many cases, that existing infrastructure was built for volumes that are no longer needed for that infrastructure. And so in those cases, you run the risk of having fluid drop out or pooling just from velocity challenges. So there's various reasons why you might look at an existing infrastructure for a pipeline replacement. But generally speaking, our focus, our sales pitch is to say, remove that liability, which it is in some cases from your balance sheet. And convert it back into an asset, whether it was in operation or whether or not it was idled or shut in at that time. Again, to us, it is simply a hole in the ground that is perfectly aligned with the route that we want to pursue. And so we can take a look at sliplining and pulling through our existing pipeline system. And like I mentioned earlier, we can continue the service that it was once used for, whether it be crude or gas, or we can completely change the service. Especially with the emerging markets in the hydrogen and carbon capture worlds, which our products are ideally suited for. You can take that once utilized infrastructure and completely change its purpose and not to mention do so at a fraction of the cost of a new lay. And you really start to stack up a lot of efficiencies and value proposition for the end user there.

00:13:30 KC Yost
I was just going to say that leads you to your value proposition, isn't it? You're able to take an asset that may be obsolete, take advantage of the right of way that you have, the void that you have there. And put something in for either a new service for an existing product or a new product line or whatever and literally rehabilitate the entire system. So that's pretty darn cool. So if we have a pipeline that needs to be rehabilitated, what is the process that you would typically expect an operating company to go through in looking at rehabilitation method?

00:14:16 David Gregory
Sure, sure. So the process from our perspective, and we pride ourselves on staying hands-on throughout this process, again, because it is a very new concept. A very new product to begin with in many cases. But the concept of sliplining and pipeline rehabilitation is brand-new to many customers. So again, we stay very tied to the hip, make sure that all value is captured. But generally, the process starts with the operator allowing us to understand what they need out of their system, what pressures, what flow rate, what temperatures they need. And then that allows us to identify what minimum viable product from our portfolio would be suited for that application. Once that is defined, then we start to say, "Hey, is there an existing infrastructure on the route that you want to pursue? And if there is, what are the sizes? What are the conditions of that line? Are there PIs? Are there any constraints that we need to know about?" And often that comes in the form of a KMZ, your Google Earth files. Or in the best-case scenario, your actual as-builts or alignment sheets that fully define both the route of the pipeline, but then the details of that pipeline. The radius of the bend, the type of bend it is, the angle. And then from there really allows us to start the analytical process. So my team and I, when we get that information, we focus on actually going back and modeling in a 3D space. The dimensions of those bends, the dimensions of those PIs, and the severity of them. And then one, we will identify whether or not we can pull through that existing infrastructure. If we can, it'll often stay in place. And if we cannot, we will plan to remove that and it will become a bell hole used for our entry and exit points on execution. From there, we're able to then maximize the length of the pull based on the capabilities of our product, which is where that tensile rating really comes into play. We'll evaluate straight line loads, of course, the friction involved there. And then of course, the capstan effect that you start to build up as you pull around multiple PI. So there's quite a bit of analysis that goes into it. But again, we pride ourselves on having an output of a simple construction plan, if you will, that identifies the locations of the bell holes and then the links and expected tensile loads that we might see for that pull. So we put it in a nice neat package for our customers, and then we will go execute. Of course, we have our deployment trailers and our swedge machines that are proprietary to FlexSteel, but then we partner with industry leaders in the wireline space. And when I say wireline, most people think down hole, but these are just winches on steroids, if you can imagine that. They use a synthetic rope that is as strong as steel but is of course spoolable in a small compact space. Very light, but very strong. Does not damage the host pipe integrity as we pull back through there. And really allows us to do some pretty unique things. And when I say unique things, we've done some pulls that have exceeded two miles of continuous pipe. And of course, that's multiple pipe packages with their associated fittings. But two miles of continuous product pulled through an existing infrastructure from one entry point to one exit point. A bell hole for our products typically range from 15 to 30 feet, depending on the size. So you can imagine the efficiencies gained with, if you assume a 30-foot bell hole, you've got 60 linear feet of excavated ground. Excavated existing infrastructure with two miles of a brand-new pipeline pulled through there. So again, the scalability of the process and the value proposition is tremendous. But even on a small scale, you can start to really see the cost savings from an installation perspective.

00:18:05 KC Yost
Well, two miles is fascinating. And you say that that was done in multiple pulls. Did I misunderstand that?

00:18:13 David Gregory
No. So it was actually done in a single pull. So one of the major value propositions for all RTP products is the spoolable nature. So your typical commoditized solutions are going to come in a 40-foot joint with... I'll speak specifically to FlexSteel because I know that product. We have a two-inch reel, a reel of two-inch pipe that's over a mile of continuous pipe. So 6, 500 feet, give or take. We have some unique packaging options that actually coil our larger diameter products. And a six inch, we can get about a half mile of continuous pipe. Our eight inches is about a quarter mile, and our 10 inch, which is industry leading, is about 5 to 600 feet. So again, you can see just simply on a single package basis, the value proposition for any installation type of a spooled or a coiled product relative to a stick solution there. Now, in the case of a two-mile pull that was multiple packages of that skew, that design with the proper pipe to pipe couplings what we call a midline fitting. Meant to connect the composite to the composite or the RTP to the RTP there. And we just simply stacked those together and pulled it through the host pipe and then piggybacked our way onto the next pull. So some pulls can be five, 600 feet. Of course, some can be two miles in length just depending on what that existing infrastructure calls for.

00:19:39 KC Yost
Gotcha, gotcha. And as far as prepping the host line, all you need to do is make sure that there's no obstruction there that will keep the initial pig with the pull line from getting hung up.

00:19:53 David Gregory
That's correct. That's spot on. Yes, sir.

00:19:55 KC Yost
As compared to the CIPP and some of these other processes where you've got to make sure that the host pipeline ID is nice and clean. I don't know if it needs to be nice near white, but at least prep to a point where it's going to let the epoxy or whatever adhere to the ID. You don't have that concern, do you?

00:20:19 David Gregory
Correct. No. We generally do not require, or quite frankly, are not concerned about the integrity of the host pipe any further because it is simply a conduit for us. But we do ask for things to be safe, right? Of course, we'll make sure that the operator has pigged that line in some recent time to make sure there's no liquids or anything still in place of the pipeline. Once they've made those pigging runs, to your point, the wireline company that we work with will come out. They will flange up to the existing infrastructure, typically using a 150 ANSI slip-on flange. They will then bolt up to that utilizing their wireline unit. And then they'll have that pig that you had mentioned that serves two purposes. Of course, the primary purpose of that pig is to get that synthetic rope from one end to the other such that it can pull back the RTP product. But that pig will also be equipped with a sizing plate. And that sizing plate is generally sized based on either the ID of the host pipe or the OD of the new product going through there. So in some sense, to make sure that we can effectively model or at least trial a similar sized product going through that host pipe. And what it's effectively looking for is dents or ovalities or over-penetrations from a weld that may cause an obstruction or could potentially damage the product, the RTP product that is being pulled through. So that pig is very effective, a very simple, very simple solution, but very effective in making sure that that existing infrastructure is suitable to be pulled through. And at that point, it's grab onto the reel or coil of the RTP product and simply pull it back through. And there's a lot of planning that goes into this. There's a lot of effort in making sure that everything's done properly, and then you get to execute. And the actual insertion of the pipeline is the fastest part of the process. I mean, we've pulled pipe in at about 100 to 150 feet a second. So the faster we go, the fewer times we stop, the better from a tensile load anyway. So once it gets rolling, it's a very smooth process.

00:22:28 KC Yost
Yeah, you want to take advantage of the inertia that you build up, don't you?

00:22:31 David Gregory
Absolutely. Absolutely. And we don't want to create any more static friction and have to overcome that than we do. So we will also use lubricants. We've used canola oil, which is of course economically and environmentally friendly. But then for some longer pulls, we've got some down-hole grade lubricants that really get that smooth surface there for us to really get that friction factor low. And that's really what allows us to stretch our legs, KC, is the removal of that friction factor. We've started looking even in the offshore space about some offshore rehabilitation projects. And in that case, it starts to be a floating conversation. The specific gravity of the pipe relative to the specific gravity of the seawater. In that case, in a floating environment, your friction's quite low. So your calculated pull distances can be quite eye-opening. But again, it just really speaks to the value proposition of pipeline rehabilitation in general.

00:23:27 KC Yost
Yeah. Not to get off on the subject too far, but we do the same thing when it comes to directional drill sizing and all of that. We want to make sure that we've got the right buoyancy with the pipe, maybe add a little water to the ID of the pipe. So that as we do the pullback through the hole, the annulus that's been created in the HDD, we minimize the friction because the pipe is actually floating inside the annulus where the mud is. So we eliminate any friction rubbing up against the walls of the drill annulus. So it makes perfect sense to me. Makes perfect sense to me. That's good. That's good. So this all sounds fascinating. So let's talk about cost. What is the cost relative using an RTP pipe-in-pipe if you say arrangement versus relatively to digging and repairing an existing line?

00:24:27 David Gregory
Right. Well, when you compare it to dig and repair of an existing line, you have to also include the steps that got you to that decision point. You've got an existing infrastructure. If it's a steel line, you're likely going to run some inline inspection tool that is going to begin to identify anomalies, identify corrosion in that wall. And those are costly, right? Those can be quite capital intensive. And the unfortunate reality there is, they haven't solved any problem. They've just further confirmed that you do have an integrity issue that needs to be dealt with. So that's step one. When you simply just start to look at the construction costs of pick and replace or even a new lay, the savings really start to add up. Like I had mentioned, a typical bell hole is about 30 feet. If you're going to do a pick and replace every time you see an anomaly, you're going to have, in some cases, virtually a brand-new pipeline. Which every time you have to dig and replace, you've got all of those continuous costs. But we've seen some customers, KC, that have saved, I don't know, 15 to 20% relative to a new lay. We've seen customers save up to 70% relative to a new lay, just depending on the size, the length, and the complexity of the routing challenges. So that's really where the cost savings comes into play. And quite frankly, that's really what drives the industry interest in this solution. And in many cases, right, wrong, or otherwise, operators are a little more hesitant to utilize pipeline products or pipeline solutions that aren't the commoditized known material that has been around for forever. Especially in the midstream space, you really have to find that opportunity to say, "Look, the value here is so great, so tremendous that we cannot overlook this solution." And once we get a first shot, we generally get a second and third and fourth shot. Once the customer sees the value, sees the process, sees how efficient, and again, realizes those savings, they begin to open their eyes to the solution. But then also, really start to look closely at their infrastructure and say, "Is it worth running another ILI tool to tell us what we already know? Or should we look at pulling something back through there and actually sizing this pipeline as it should be sized? To help eliminate that corrosion and put a new product in there that's going to eliminate or severely slow down corrosion from that same flowing environment."

00:27:00 KC Yost
So this gets back to PHMSA and DOT's definition of sound engineering practices, doesn't it?

00:27:08 David Gregory
Yes, sir.

00:27:10 KC Yost
Where you have a product that is new. We experienced that. Clock Spring comes to mind and FlexSteel does as well where you're not getting an endorsement from the federal government. But they're willing to allow you to, as an operator, say something to the effect that you've used sound engineering judgment in deciding that this is the way we want to repair this segment of pipeline in order to move forward. And that's a big part of what you do, is it not?

00:27:45 David Gregory
Yes, sir. Absolutely. And that's again, that market value driver there is utilizing this solution in places that you may not get a new pipeline permitted. We've had customers in regulated applications, both 192 and 195 find that they need to traverse a national forest, or they need to traverse a navigable waterway. And there's a decent chance that in many of our lifetimes, you will not get a new pipeline permitted or it's going to be very, very challenging. So to be able to utilize that existing infrastructure just completely flips that discussion on its head. Now, to your point, the only materials that are currently codified in 49 CFR are your steel and HDPE materials. So we do have to go through what is called a special permit process in regulated applications, mind you. Unregulated, we can install it as soon as it hits the floor and is ready to ship. But in those regulated spaces, we have to go through a special permit process. And to your point, identify the sound engineering judgment that has been utilized to both prove the capability of the RTP that is being installed, which in our case is driven by API 15S. And then of course, show the routing and the planned installation and operation of that pipeline through the existing infrastructure. So a few different steps. We've built out templates. We've really gotten that process streamlined. We have a tremendous success record on both 192 and 195 across the country. Believe it or not, we have two permits approved in California. We've got many in Texas, around the country, really and truly. And that number is growing constantly. But that process is again showing PHMSA that there are alternative solutions out there. Engineered solutions mind you, that are just as good, if not better in some cases than the commoditized incumbent there. And so it really allows us to showcase our capabilities. And then ultimately, our goal here at FlexSteel is to get API 15S, and to get our product incorporated by reference into those specs. And depending on who you talk to and maybe more viable than others, but I plan to be here for the long term. So I hope that that goal still remains on the table. But at that point, once you reach a codified space, you no longer have that special permit, and you can install the product in any application regulated or unregulated. We're at that place in Canada. We do a lot of work in Canada, and everything up there is completely regulated. So in some sense, there's an argument to be made that we should just rip the Band-Aid off here in the States and start regulating everything and just get everybody up to speed. But I understand that the cost in prohibitive challenges there from an installation and operation perspective. So there's always give and take. But in a regulated space, we have proven that track record and we have ongoing conversations virtually every week about new opportunities there.

00:30:50 KC Yost
Good. Well, a couple of things you mentioned O&M and you've mentioned PHMSA two or three times. So that gets back into the mega rule, if you will, and worrying about pipeline integrity. The need to prove pipeline integrity and what is the O&M process for this product to make sure that it's going to be in good shape 20 years down the road?

00:31:18 David Gregory
Sure. Sure. No, it's a great question and really goes back to PHMSA's comfortability with it. So when we manufacture our product, we of course complete all the factory acceptance testing, which is the big one there is a hydrotest. We hydrotest every inch of our product before it leaves the facility to make sure that it is fully fit for service before it leaves and ends up on the right of way. And then once you've got it laid out and installed, you would still have your same commissioning hydrotest that you would with any existing pipeline material. Again, that is not to confirm really much the integrity of the pipe because we've already done that. But make sure that those fittings have been properly installed and are of the same pressure rating there. And then beyond that, it's really going to be dependent on which product you use. I'll speak specifically for FlexSteel. We have a unique ability to actually pneumatically test the integrity of that outer layer of HDPE because of the unbonded nature of our product design. It's what we call our ShieldSure Annulus Test. It's as simple as injecting an inert gas into that space, pressurizing it. And showing that a positive and continuous pressure is being able to be held in that space, which confirms the integrity of that outer layer of HDPE. You can think of it in very similar sense to a jeeping process where you evaluate a steel pipeline once it has been laid in the ground to make sure that that outer coating there has not been damaged. And thus, you're not worried about an external environment affecting the integrity of the pipeline. That ShieldSure test proves the exact same purpose for us, making sure that that outer layer of HDPE is fully intact. Now, what we've seen in a regulated space is we can actually take that inherent product design and apply it to an actual operating condition wherein we call it annulus monitoring. So you would take what was once a post installation integrity check and now apply blanket pressure, tie that back into your SCADA systems. And have full real time in this case two layer. And then in the case of rehab, three-layer pressure monitoring capabilities to prove the integrity of every layer of material that you have in that pipeline system. So again, when it goes back to PHMSA, it's proving to them not only one that you can meet the minimum requirement that is listed for the codified materials, but how do you go above and beyond? And that annular space and the ability to monitor pressures in that space is really in my mind, what has set FlexSteel aside as far as the success that we've had.

00:33:52 KC Yost
Sure. Again, you're dealing with an industry that needs to have proof of structural integrity. And with this application, you do have that capability. So that's pretty cool stuff. Good for you. We're talking a little bit pastime, David. Is there anything that you want the industry to know about the products and what we're talking about with regard to rehabilitation of pipelines?

00:34:24 David Gregory
Yeah. I think in closing, the big thing there I'd say KC is... I often use a quote that it's typically attributed to Henry Ford. But the quote is, "If you always do what you've always done, you'll always get what you've always got." And I know it sounds a little whimsical there. In my mind, it's a general sense to the pipeline and to the energy industry as a whole to start to really look at the practices that have been around for forever. And not in the sense that look at them in the sense that they're wrong but look at them in the sense that there's opportunity for enhancement, opportunity for optimization. FlexSteel is only a small fraction of the total industry development that has happened over the last two decades, and the continuous involvement, evolution, I should say, of that industry. And so there's a lot of new technologies out there that can really simplify and even optimize the practices and processes that engineers and operators go through every day. So definitely just to keep an eye out for those things, especially as the new generation comes in. Just because it's always been done that way doesn't mean there's not room for improvement.

00:35:38 KC Yost
Well, as someone who's lived through learning how to do directional drills, as someone who remembers when Clock Spring was originally introduced to the industry. We've always been a little reluctant to be the first person out the door. But once a track record is achieved, we have been quick to embrace things. And I think that that'll be the case with reinforced thermoplastic pipes like the one FlexSteel has. So again, totally understand and I appreciate you taking the time to visit with us today.

00:36:17 David Gregory
Yeah. Absolutely, KC. Definitely appreciate the time.

00:36:20 KC Yost
Yeah. So if anyone would like to learn more about FlexSteel, find them on the web at flexsteelpipe. com. So thanks to all of you for tuning into this episode of The Energy Pipeline Podcast, sponsored by Caterpillar Oil & Gas. If you have any questions, comments, or ideas for podcasts topics, feel free to email me at kc.yost@oggn.com. I also want to thank my producer, Anastasia Willison-Duff and everyone at the Oil and Gas Global Network for making this podcast possible. Find out more about other OGGN podcasts at oggn. com. So this is KC Yost saying goodbye for now. Have a great week and keep that energy flowing through the pipeline.

00:37:08 Speaker 2
Come back next week for another episode of The Energy Pipeline, a production of the Oil and Gas Global Network. To learn more, go to oggn.com.